tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post3225722226169895539..comments2024-03-28T02:36:04.078-07:00Comments on Health Correlator: Low omega-6 to omega-3 ratio: Grain-fed meats or industrial vegetable oils?Ned Kockhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02755560885749335053noreply@blogger.comBlogger50125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-73656545460395380572018-07-28T11:40:06.447-07:002018-07-28T11:40:06.447-07:00This post is a revised version of a previous post....This post is a revised version of a previous post. The original comments are preserved here. More comments welcome, but no spam please!Ned Kockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02755560885749335053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-36871953784435884722012-08-06T11:57:40.871-07:002012-08-06T11:57:40.871-07:00I didn't see this question addressed above: if...I didn't see this question addressed above: if you feed pigs or chickens that matter an evolutionarily appropriate diet, would their omega 3 to 6 ratios be better?TPCRP!https://www.blogger.com/profile/00518869302329937432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-64118925099033518922011-09-16T17:07:59.760-07:002011-09-16T17:07:59.760-07:00Thanks for your article. I was worried about the o...Thanks for your article. I was worried about the omega 6 acids in animal meat. I'm trying to find grass fed meat for my 21 year old son. He has ulcerative colitis. We are using, coconut oil, olive oil and butter. I have him on a non processed food diet. I'm trying to lower his intake of Omega 6 or have him eat the correct balance of 3 to 6 omegas. Industrial vegetable oils are out of his diet and we see an immediate improvement. It's in so many processed foods and restaurant foods. Perhaps pork should not be a part of his diet or an occasional meat? Not sure.<br />~AnnAnnnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-34567517028642769202011-08-21T16:34:47.748-07:002011-08-21T16:34:47.748-07:00Ned, is arachidonic acid worse than fructose: http...Ned, is arachidonic acid worse than fructose: <a href="http://inhumanexperiment.blogspot.com/2009/10/fats-and-ages-pufas-are-even-worse-than.html" rel="nofollow">http://inhumanexperiment.blogspot.com/2009/10/fats-and-ages-pufas-are-even-worse-than.html</a> ?gwarmhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00059000185578090757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-31958852429278906172011-08-21T16:34:19.024-07:002011-08-21T16:34:19.024-07:00Is arachidonic acid worse than fructose: http://in...Is arachidonic acid worse than fructose: http://inhumanexperiment.blogspot.com/2009/10/fats-and-ages-pufas-are-even-worse-than.html ?gwarmhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00059000185578090757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-19110669447664723472011-03-22T15:05:29.922-07:002011-03-22T15:05:29.922-07:00Just wanted to point out that a couple of the vege...Just wanted to point out that a couple of the vegetable oils have much lower n6 levels. High-oleic sunflower, for example, is supposed to have about a twentieth the n6 of regular safflower (less than olive oil), and high-oleic safflower has about a sixth. I wonder whether there is any other reason to avoid those two oils. If not, they could be useful occasionally, having a rather higher smoke point than most fats, like butter, olive, lard, and tallow.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03866578515245767292noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-35593397261561143482011-02-02T02:22:37.136-08:002011-02-02T02:22:37.136-08:00I don't really like reading a long article but...I don't really like reading a long article but this article about omega 3 is very interesting and I can't stop from reading it. I learned a lot of good things in reading this post.best omega 3http://omega3information.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-66498136198530882302011-01-09T21:51:08.600-08:002011-01-09T21:51:08.600-08:00Yes we must consider the dose. I'm obsessing o...Yes we must consider the dose. I'm obsessing over this topic right now and Matt Stone is referring to "Inflammation Nation," in which the author states that AA from grain fed animals can be a huge problem. So basically, X amount of omega-6 needs to be differentiated into LA and AA as animals convert LA to AA more than we do. <br /><br />Here's that post I'm referring to:<br />http://180degreehealth.blogspot.com/search/label/Omega%206%20fatty%20acids Hm, i shold go to bedAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05678720294816251435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-2466620552204365972010-10-05T05:39:19.205-07:002010-10-05T05:39:19.205-07:00The idea that we need to maintain an exact 1:1 rat...The idea that we need to maintain an exact 1:1 ratio is probably a myth. Our African paleolithic ancestors probably maintained a 2:1<br />ratio of omega-6 to omega-3. So a 1:1 ratio may be outside our evolutionary norm.<br /><br />Yes, it may be more *AESTHETICALLY* appealing if the ideal balance is a 1:1 ratio. But evolution isn't perfect. So even if omega-6 is inflammatory, that does *not* necessarily mean that omega-3 is equally anti-inflammatory. Our bodies are not designed to be that elegant. Biochemically, things are far more complex.<br /><br />Men can't convert much alpha-linolenic acid into DHA acid as women do. This may be an explanation expiation. Since DHA is essential for<br />childbearing, and men don't bear any children, it would be unnecessary for men to convert that much ALA into DHA. It's probably harmful for men to convert unnecessary amounts of ALA into DHA, because of the increased oxidation of DHA.<br /><br />So what justifies a perfect 1:1 balance, besides aesthetics?3D Face Analysishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07002380940176488169noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-14761295744271624762010-10-05T05:35:53.094-07:002010-10-05T05:35:53.094-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.3D Face Analysishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07002380940176488169noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-36333683831776830242010-10-05T05:15:14.405-07:002010-10-05T05:15:14.405-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.3D Face Analysishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07002380940176488169noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-87512769577428077622010-10-02T06:13:16.361-07:002010-10-02T06:13:16.361-07:00I did some numbers on grass-fed vs grain-fed beef ...I did some numbers on grass-fed vs grain-fed beef myself and decided it was not as negligible a factor as some have made it out to be. And I have little access to grass-fed.<br /><br />But when you compare it to a Tbs of industrial oil it looks paltry indeed.praguestepchildhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04219985675023163249noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-49926816458695198432010-09-17T21:26:29.437-07:002010-09-17T21:26:29.437-07:00Bawa Fishmeal & company offers a wide variety ...Bawa Fishmeal & company offers a wide variety of fish oil products, squalene oil, steam sterilized fish meal, fish liver oil, marine products and sardine fish oil at affordable prices in India.Centrifuged Sardine Fish Oilhttp://bawafishmeal.tradeindia.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-49591366163249779052010-09-10T09:44:38.932-07:002010-09-10T09:44:38.932-07:00Here is an interesting study showing that, in a ve...Here is an interesting study showing that, in a very particular context, an increase in omega-6 intake (as arachidonic acid) may be health-promoting:<br /><br />http://www.springerlink.com/content/32373hr7qv2q5775/<br /><br />The context is what the authors call a "hypocaloric carbohydrate restricted die". That is, a low carb diet where one consumes fewer calories than needed for weight maintenance.<br /><br />What is probably happening here, I believe, is that some health benefits are compensating for some potential health problems. It is reasonable to speculate that if the low carb diet was even lower in AA, one would see even more health benefits.Ned Kockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02755560885749335053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-58217944478810040882010-09-10T08:19:56.196-07:002010-09-10T08:19:56.196-07:00Hi Anon.
Once you have a glucose metabolism probl...Hi Anon.<br /><br />Once you have a glucose metabolism problem, but still have an HbA1c lower than 7.3, the main contributor by far to HbA1c is postprandial glucose. The contribution of fasting hyperglycemia in that context is close to irrelevant:<br /><br />http://healthcorrelator.blogspot.com/2010/05/postprandial-glucose-levels-hba1c-and.html<br /><br />And going low carb is one of the most effective ways around to keep postprandial glucose under control. Eating things like bananas or potatoes may create serious problems for people with impaired glucose metabolism.Ned Kockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02755560885749335053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-30263844862613417982010-09-08T17:48:16.603-07:002010-09-08T17:48:16.603-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Ned Kockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02755560885749335053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-6375731344278765752010-09-08T10:00:26.857-07:002010-09-08T10:00:26.857-07:00"Having said that, depending on one’s level o..."Having said that, depending on one’s level of insulin resistance, a primal ketogenic diet may be much better. Carbs, even from fruits and tubers, are toxic for some people; that is an undeniable reality."<br /><br />Sorry to stay off topic but I wonder if you could clarify your comment. Is it not possible that a ketogenic diet could over time lead to progressively worse insulin resistance? My fasting blood glucose levels have risen in the 5 months I have been low carb whole foods(paleo).<br /> <br />Peter of hyperlipid has said the same, his glucose levels can get quite high although hb-a1c are low.<br /><br />Doesn't a high fat diet lead to insulin resistance as well? After all, if we restrict carbs the calories have to come from somewhere. My rising blood sugar coinciding with low carb scares me because it has always been low.<br /><br />Thanks for the help and I love your blog.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-28471854200212863602010-09-07T17:50:24.541-07:002010-09-07T17:50:24.541-07:00Feeding pigs fish oil would probably be safer for ...Feeding pigs fish oil would probably be safer for us:<br /><br />http://www.animalfeedscience.com/article/S0377-8401(03)00253-0/abstractNed Kockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02755560885749335053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-1942885789778943842010-09-07T15:02:40.697-07:002010-09-07T15:02:40.697-07:00Via Wikipedia:
Linoleic acid is 18:2(n-6).
Arachi...Via Wikipedia:<br /><br />Linoleic acid is 18:2(n-6).<br />Arachidonic acid is 20:4(n-6).<br /><br />Via the USDA Nutrient Database: <br /><br />e.g., 454 grams of Pork, fresh, loin, center rib (chops or roasts), boneless, separable lean and fat, raw<br /><br />has<br /><br />18:2(undifferentiated) 5.675g<br />20:4(undifferentiated) 0.409g<br /><br />Even undifferentiated it's pretty clear that 18:2(n-6+n-3) far exceeds 20:4.<br /><br />Other pork cuts have similar ratios.<br /><br />I don't think worrying about grainfed cattle is useful, but pork is a bit more problematical. Chicken is a little worse than pork.<br /><br />However, even a pound of pork or chicken has at most 7-8g of n-6. Compared to your tbsp of vegetable oil at 14g, it's not worth worrying about.Samhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02959738746592888535noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-29173138134904075232010-09-07T14:26:12.379-07:002010-09-07T14:26:12.379-07:00Re. the primal ketogenic versus non-ketogenic. My ...Re. the primal ketogenic versus non-ketogenic. My take on this is that if you are not insulin resistant, both are pretty effective at getting your weight up to healthy levels.<br /><br />From a naturalness perspective, Sapiens evolved to be an omnivore, so fruits and tubers are in. In fact, a diet with plenty of fruits and tubers will probably have an edge in terms of hunger up-regulation.<br /><br />The insulin spikes created by fruits and tubers are not all that higher than those elicited by natural protein-rich foods. They are much lower than those elicited by bagels and doughnuts though.<br /><br />Having said that, depending on one’s level of insulin resistance, a primal ketogenic diet may be much better. Carbs, even from fruits and tubers, are toxic for some people; that is an undeniable reality.Ned Kockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02755560885749335053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-79542928293866324862010-09-07T14:17:27.384-07:002010-09-07T14:17:27.384-07:00Hi Hans, thanks.Hi Hans, thanks.Ned Kockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02755560885749335053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-87521908634937650412010-09-07T14:16:48.352-07:002010-09-07T14:16:48.352-07:00Hi Jack.
Good point. My understanding is that the...Hi Jack.<br /><br />Good point. My understanding is that the alcohol was added to provide a baseline that would make the effects occur within a short timeline (assuming that the effects would occur anyway, but within a much longer timeline without the alcohol). This is not uncommon in experimental studies. Here are two that are a bit more to the point, comparing different fats, still with alcohol intake as a moderator:<br /><br />http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9397995<br /><br />http://jpet.aspetjournals.org/content/299/2/638.long<br /><br />If I recall it properly, the two studies above have been discussed by Peter in the same context. I know, rats are not humans, but the case for fish oil supplementation, at least in large amounts, doesn’t look very good.<br /><br />And note that I refer to fish oil, which has never been part of the traditional Inuit diet. Consumption of omega-3 through natural foods is another story. A lot of other macro- and micro-nutrients come together, perhaps some very important ones. In this context you can also expect some hunger regulation of intake, which doesn’t happen with supplements.Ned Kockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02755560885749335053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-10242303949576601202010-09-07T14:16:12.113-07:002010-09-07T14:16:12.113-07:00Hi Mal.
Definitely the sardines provide omega-3 i...Hi Mal.<br /><br />Definitely the sardines provide omega-3 in a much more natural way, and in a relatively large quantity. A lot of other macro- and micro-nutrients come together, perhaps some very important ones.Ned Kockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02755560885749335053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-6209426329283902692010-09-07T12:47:19.603-07:002010-09-07T12:47:19.603-07:00been reading more past posts of yours on the blog....been reading more past posts of yours on the blog...and i have a question.<br /><br />what is your opinion on using a primal ketogenic diet to gain weight vs a primal nonketogenic diet to gain weight?<br /><br />i ask because it seems from the posts that overeating and gaining on a keto-diet will induce a further and worse insulin resistance and set you up for future failure unless you plan to stay keto for life.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8859456735165996893.post-69543606920321939652010-09-07T12:39:44.875-07:002010-09-07T12:39:44.875-07:00Ned,
It seems to me that your statement that fish...Ned,<br /><br />It seems to me that your statement that fish oil may be toxic to the liver is misleading. The study stated that fish oil, like corn oil, may support "alcohol induced liver injury". There is no indication in the abstract that fish oil injures the liver in absence of alcohol.<br /><br />I am not aware that the Inuit have any liver problems from all the omega-3 they eat.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com